22 mm spindle does not fit into 22 mm bearings

[DaddyCool]

Hello,

I have a 22 mm titanium spindle from an old aluminium KHE crank. I ordered Mid BB bearings which I could slide onto the spindle. Now I have installed the bearings in a new WTP Utopia frame and I can not slide the spindle into the bearings/frame any more.

Did this happen to anyone here? Any advice?

I guess it is due to tolerances. Maybe the bearings are slightly compressed in radial direction because they are pressed into the bottom bracket shell. But how can this be solved?
It would be a big effort to decrease the axle diameter on a lathe (because I do not have one and would need to find somebody...) so I would like to find another solution.

Any ideas are welcome! Thanks.

[metalbmxer]

take the BB spacer out
probably getting hung up on the edge!

[Revig]

maybe the bearings you bought are défectives? (I assume that spindle was installed before on a other bike with other bearings on it)

maybe contact your shop and tell your problem, they might have a remplacement solution

can you measure precisely that spindle? in order to be sure if it's more or not than 22mm. Same with the bearings (don't even think to modify that spindle unless you are sure the problem lies on it )

[DaddyCool]

Thank you so far!
I am pretty sure it is not the spacer because I can not even slide the spindle a few millimeter into the bearing (before the spacer area begins) without pressing really hard.
I think the bearing are ok because I could slide them onto the spindle when they were not in the frame.
I will measure the spindle and bearings in the next days, but I do not have something for that at home...

[TRUTH1970]

hi, I had the same problem about 3 years ago when I got a custom Intrikat  frame and put my Ti phat black widow spindle in ( 19mm ) . what I did was I put the crank spindle in the freezer for a few hours, and the cold must have shrunk it enough to allow me to tap it in with a rubber mallet. I then let it warm up over night before I put the arms on. might be worth trying that ? all the best

[masonmar]

It does sound like your BB is warped from welding. If you can slide your bearing on the spindle when it's out of the BB but can't when it's pressed in then that's probably what it is. Maybe try putting the spindle through the BB shell then sliding the bearings on each side and press them in with the spindle on.

[DaddyCool]

Hi guys,
thanks for your input!
The freezer idea sounds good... But could you remove the spindle later? I am afraid of it staying in there forever.
I have to measure the bearings and spindle first, but I do not have a caliper, so I need to go to a friend these days.

[Revig]

Masonmar made a good point, issue lies first on the frame.
I would contact the shop where the frame was bought from and tell the facts, they might have a solution, at least they have to react to that issue of one of their customer

[DaddyCool]

"Unfortunately" I was lucky enough to win this frame at a contest. 
 So I think I can not have it replaced even if there is something not correct.
I will measure the diameter of the spindle tomorrow at work.

[metalbmxer]

look do this:
1. slide one bearing on the spindle past most of the splines on that one side
2. tap that bearing into the frame using lots of grease
3. slide the other bearing on the spindle that is being exposed past the BB
4. now tap the other bearing into the BB

this will prevent you from damaging any of the splines on the spindle as you would have if you were to hammer that spindle thru both of the already installed bearings.
the way described above installs each bearing onto the spindle first then into the frame.

[DaddyCool]

Thank you metalbmxer,
this is good idea. But I am not so much afraid of damaging the spindle because it is one with square ends (not 48 splines) so it is not so sensitive I guess.
But one thing is not clear to me: Do you push the bearings into the frame with a rubber hammer or something like this?
I used a vice to press them in and I like this method because it is much easier to keep the bearing parallel to the outer end of the BB shell so they have less chance to tilt.

Today I measured the spindle: It is 21.98 mm at most areas, hardly more. So it is not the spindle.

I called the shop that sold me the bearings. They told me that this happend quite often with different frames and cranks and the guy said it is due to some parts being not exactly within the tolerances. He recommended the "freezer method".

So it seems to me that none of the parts is defective but it was just a bad combination.

One thing is still critical with all the options we discussed: Once the spindle is in, can I remove it one day?
I think the only way to install it and keep it easy to remove would be to change the inner diameter of the bearings a little bit (but it will be not so easy with a file and it will turn out not nice) or reduce the diameter of the spindle (which I do not like).

What do you think?

Thanks for all the input!

[Revig]

So problem still lies in the frame

then this is a list of other different options:

- sell the frame (no I kidding)

- modify the frame, make it wider where the bearings have to be placed. But it will be just hard to find the good place, people and tools to do that accurately

- try to use another spindle or even crank+bearings with that frame (but the phenomenon might still happen)

- contact the organiser of the contest where you won the frame and tell the story. It's very possible that he feel the need to find a replacement solution (especially if he's a rider) because you are f*cked up with that useless frame in some way! Hopefully he will contact the sponsor who provides the frame to find a replacement solution.

[metalbmxer]

Thank you metalbmxer,
this is good idea. But I am not so much afraid of damaging the spindle because it is one with square ends (not 48 splines) so it is not so sensitive I guess.
But one thing is not clear to me: Do you push the bearings into the frame with a rubber hammer or something like this?
I used a vice to press them in and I like this method because it is much easier to keep the bearing parallel to the outer end of the BB shell so they have less chance to tilt.

Today I measured the spindle: It is 21.98 mm at most areas, hardly more. So it is not the spindle.

I called the shop that sold me the bearings. They told me that this happend quite often with different frames and cranks and the guy said it is due to some parts being not exactly within the tolerances. He recommended the "freezer method".

So it seems to me that none of the parts is defective but it was just a bad combination.

One thing is still critical with all the options we discussed: Once the spindle is in, can I remove it one day?
I think the only way to install it and keep it easy to remove would be to change the inner diameter of the bearings a little bit (but it will be not so easy with a file and it will turn out not nice) or reduce the diameter of the spindle (which I do not like).

What do you think?

Thanks for all the input!

ah bro i thought all the fuss was about not damaging the 48 spline spindle!!!!!
You have a square spindle? Then no worries--hammer that puppy on there! you will not damage anything. Every frame is a tight fit.

Go ahead and hammer both bearings in or use your press (preferred) then tap the spindle thru with a rubber mallet. You will be set. Much ado about nothing! Ha well keep us posted or even post some pics for us!

[DaddyCool]

I measured the inner diameter of the installed bearings. It is around 21.85 mm. The spindle has an outer diameter of 21.98 mm. Not much, but too much. I tried to hammer it in with lots of grease and it did not work. I could have hit harder, but I do not like "installing" parts like this. I was really afraid of damaging something.
I might try the method with the fridge, but I think it is not really good because I will have a lot of trouble when I want to remove the spindle one day.
Another option came to my mind: If I could clamp the bearing (removed from the frame) in a vice in a way that the inner ring can not move, I could enlarge the inner diameter with a reamer. Then it might work after installing the bearings again.
What do you think?
Thank you.

[metalbmxer]

can you sand the BB on the frame and get it to be a little looser fit? try the freezer method too. it won't be so bad getting it off in the end. if anything the bearing will just pop out with it.