Author Topic: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY(PICS ADDED)  (Read 18420 times)

Offline sakis

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 1831
BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY(PICS ADDED)
« on: July 11, 2014, 01:54:06 PM »
Hello,
i would like to inform everybody here that you should be very careful when you order custom frames from
malo.
1)My frame cracked at the left seatstay then i send it to france,he cutted the seatstay in the middle and he put half new tube and half old seatstay,then after 2 months the other seatstay tube cracked.Because it was more than a year old this time i had to pay around 75 euro for the repair!i never send it back..i tig weld it here in greece.

2)we agreed to have chainstay extended with the peg at the end at 13.375 and instead he made it 13.25,when i asked malo why he never anwsered.NOT WHAT I ORDERED.

3)The back end is not welded straight,that means that the backwheel is not parallel to the front,i wanst sure about this,when i send my frame to france for malo to "repair" the frame he told me the frame is straight,but you can see this with your eyes!Not only me but at least 4 more riders,and a bike shop i ll post pics for this later..

4)My two friends alex alexandridis and george kikos frames also cracked.
my frame lasted around 12 months till it crack and the other 2 frames around 5 months of riding each one,when i asked malo why is george frame cracked he told me that the overlapping weld that george wanted at the seatpost connection is prone to crack and it is not the strongest and he doesnt have time to inform everybody what is the strongest choice...

5)Did i say already that he blocked me,miloc mihailovic,alex alexandridis,and george kikos from facebook because we upload pics with our cracked frames,each one costed 500 euro......
i build around 5 frames from solid bikes and when one frame cracked cause of wrong design they made me a new one for very very cheap,i never had problem with solid bikes and everytime they did everything perfect,...Malo instead delete us when i asked him if he want to make us 3 new frames an we could pay 500 euro for those 3 frames like a warantee or discount but he said no...
SO be careful things sometimes arent what they look from outside....I got my lesson with malo.
The truth is dark sometimes....
I have everything on email by the way...
« Last Edit: August 03, 2014, 10:44:25 PM by sakis »

Offline justfour

  • Hitchhiker
  • *****
  • Posts: 153
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS custom frames....
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2014, 02:58:34 PM »
Maybe Malo hired Kamil for fabrication...

Offline wolverines

  • Deathtrucker
  • ********
  • Posts: 754
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2014, 10:32:30 PM »
One person does all my stuff, and backs it 100%

Dylan Worsley. 

Offline alejandro

  • Funky Chicken
  • ****
  • Posts: 64
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2014, 11:00:25 AM »
Yes here is my story,

Before i bought a frame from Pir i ask him to do them lightweights,i supose it will last at least 1-2 years i payed 390 euros its alot of money! and after 4 months of riding it cracked in front of top tube see photos below,so i ask for Malo what we can do in this situation of only 4 months of riding,i expected from him to say send the frame back so i can repair it for free,its only 4 months! but i payed 130 euro including shipping the shipping was 50 euros return,and then after 6 months it crack on the uper back triangle,so i welded it here in my local welder,my point is that Malo dont respect his customers like within in 4 months frame is cracked and the customer has to pay again for everything,in order that Malo believes that its my frame of choice at least he must warn the customers to proceed to another set up so the frame dont crack in 4 months,also from a rider to proceed to a custom frame that means that he is so many years in the scene and he is expierience and wants the perfect frame and manufactor must respect those kind of clients, thing that malo didnt respect anything,so the total result is approximately 540 euros i have it 1,5 year and the frame cracked 2 times...... big value for money,so i think in my opinion it dont worth it,also my friend's, George Kikos,Sakis Doumas frame's cracked within the same story each one we payed 500 euros..... and also the most childest thing somone can do is that Pir block us from our facebook account,so in the end i dont wish the worst for him but i hope within this kind of posts that in the future he will respect his clients and at least give a warranty 6 months or 1 year so he can progress on his frame products and keep selling otherwise we all know the bad end story....

Peace!
Alex Alexandridis
http://alexalexandridis.blogspot.gr/

Offline DaddyCool

  • Deathtrucker
  • ********
  • Posts: 860
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2014, 12:21:59 PM »
Hi guys,
sorry for you having trouble, but I think there are some things to be considered.
Of course the frame should be straight and with all the desired measurement, this is for sure. But do you really think that 390 Eur is a lot of money for a custom frame? I think it is super cheap. So many parts crack when one rider uses them and do not when another one does. So Malo can not estimate if a frame will last six or ten month because he does not know how you ride. If you design your own frame, you are also responsible for how strong it is. Why didn't you chose bigger tube diameters and more wall thickness?
I personally can hardly imagine that Malo makes some money at all when he offers frames so cheap. Do you have any idea how much cheaper it is to do a mass production in Taiwan? So when Malos frame cost 500 Eur instead of 300 Eur for a normal frame, this is cheap. And if he has to repair it, he will basically pay it on his own if he does not charge you some money.
I do not know all the details and can not tell who is right and who is not, but I just would like to point out that I think some people have too high expectations.

Offline sakis

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 1831
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2014, 12:33:27 PM »
yes daddy cool you are right,when i chose my frame there was not available 0.049 thickness and 7/8" for the backend for example,for 14 mm.
Malo told me s&m and solid uses this same bullet tipped dropouts so they should be strong..
so i ride backweel i wanted to be strong we put 0.049 tube bridge and whisbone so the frame be a bit stronger in that area..
The point is that this is not professional behaviour,to erase your clients from fb and not answer back..
when i was sending the design for the frame i got fast anwsers!now that the frame is payed malo is dissapeared?
by the way my frame costed 485-490 euro with the shipping unpainted.shipping was 22 euro from france to greece.cheers malo
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 12:43:46 PM by sakis »

Offline geoflatland

  • Funky Chicken
  • ****
  • Posts: 91
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2014, 01:32:41 PM »
All i know is that i had the mankind code frame for 2 years with no problem at all and i changed this for a new custom frame from malo that it lasted 5 months...470 euro frame... this is not right you should have respect for your clients
Peace Guys and ride on!!

Offline metalbmxer

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 1969
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2014, 01:49:05 PM »
I'm skeptical of this claim. I heard the story of a Greek rider that custom ordered parts with a light weight design only to have been ABUSED and later broken. 

Don't get me wrong I'd be upset too, but when you are throwing your bike learning bike flips or whatever it was yall were doing then it should be expected that the part/frame would break.

And it is unprofessional to post it publicly like this. You should have tried to work 1 on 1 with him to purchase a new frame at the cost price.

Not trying to come across as unfriendly, but I want to get the other side of the story out there.

Dax (now in LAS VEGAS as of July 2022)

Offline Paradoxium

  • Administrator
  • GF Inhabitant
  • ******
  • Posts: 4433
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2014, 01:54:50 PM »
Sounds like a thicker gauge tubing is needed. Problem is most think more about light weight, instead of maybe a little bit heavier but lasts forever.
Sorry to hear of your troubles guys.

Offline sakis

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 1831
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2014, 02:21:42 PM »
metalbmer:

you probably havent read the topic or the posts,please read again SLOWLY this time.
we tried to make 3 new frames with malo when they all cracked,he said i will not make parts for you anymore.
He even asked me why i didnt buy a frame with lifetime warantee since i am hard on backweel...instead he could say to me the tubes i have now at the moment (since i told him i ride hard)are not for hard riding,instead of this he told me bike companies use those tubes...
how do you know we do bikeflips?
Since i pay 500 euro i want my frame to last for newschool riding,or else i ll buy something that is ready.
unprofessional is not to anwser back your clients and not helping them,please do not tell me what is right and wrong, i already run two bussiness both with lot of communication and i have great feedback.
plus we are the three of us 30 plus years and ride 15 years each one...we are not kids that dont know about bmx and came here to write bad things adn make bad to a bike company.

We all already contact him many times and i havent got an anwser at my last email,then he delete the three of us at facebook..
we told him to make us three frames paying 500 euro total so we would then have a good opinion since the frames are 1 year and less old and he sayed he will never make parts for us anymore.

This is unprofessional 100%.Not the post here.


paradoxium
i agree with you my frame for example weights 2.150 kg,i consider this as a heavy frame for flatland since all the frames weight round 1.9 kg nowdays.i expect it to be strong not cut twce.



Offline 2flat2furious

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 4210
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2014, 06:48:51 PM »
If you get a year out of a frame that's a pretty good lifespan these days. My mankind code is the first frame I've had that's lasted that long or longer.

Were any of you doing bunnyhop tailwhips?

Offline sakis

  • GF Inhabitant
  • ********
  • Posts: 1831
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2014, 09:38:58 PM »
i do bunnyhop whips but i do them for 6 years now.
i ve  learn them with lighter frames weight 1.7 kg,like 4 frames from solid,i was doing them for hours and for lot of sessions,2 s&m intrikat frames,a wtp div frames and maybe others i cant remember the last 6 years..All of them no problem at all
the pir frame that is the heaviest of all cracked and the last year i only do them maybe one two times at a session or ever 2-3 sessions..
whoppers have nothing to do with those 3 frames
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 10:06:03 PM by sakis »

Offline byke

  • Backpacker
  • ******
  • Posts: 293
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2014, 12:01:38 PM »

I had read Sakis original post on Facebook and did ask why the seat stay had cracked, he informed me that it was because the tubing was too thin. Now, here is the 50 million dollar question, did sakis agree to this spec of tubing?

According to him, yes he did.
Originally Sakis had asked for a slightly thicker tubing but was informed by PIR that it wasn't available at the time. So he chose to go with the thinner tubbing.

This is a custom frame.


My view is, if you agree to a detail that is different to what and it breaks.
Then that choice is purely on your own head.
When you order a custom frame, you do so based on your instructions and what is available.
If it can't be made to how you want, you have 2 choices.

1. Don't go through with the order.
or
2. Go ahead with it, and be responsible for your choice if it doesn't work out.

I mean no disrespect to with Sakis or PIR.
But quality is based on craftsmanship.
And you can't judge quality on poor design choices.

Sakis chose the wrong tubing, he agreed to using thinner tubbing as that was what was available at the time and now it cracked.

Offline byke

  • Backpacker
  • ******
  • Posts: 293
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2014, 12:09:38 PM »
Yes here is my story,

Before i bought a frame from Pir i ask him to do them lightweights,i supose it will last at least 1-2 years i payed 390 euros its alot of money! and after 4 months of riding it cracked in front of top tube see photos below,so i ask for Malo what we can do in this situation of only 4 months of riding,i expected from him to say send the frame back so i can repair it for free,its only 4 months! but i payed 130 euro including shipping the shipping was 50 euros return,and then after 6 months it crack on the uper back triangle,so i welded it here in my local welder,my point is that Malo dont respect his customers like within in 4 months frame is cracked and the customer has to pay again for everything,in order that Malo believes that its my frame of choice at least he must warn the customers to proceed to another set up so the frame dont crack in 4 months,also from a rider to proceed to a custom frame that means that he is so many years in the scene and he is expierience and wants the perfect frame and manufactor must respect those kind of clients, thing that malo didnt respect anything,so the total result is approximately 540 euros i have it 1,5 year and the frame cracked 2 times...... big value for money,so i think in my opinion it dont worth it,also my friend's, George Kikos,Sakis Doumas frame's cracked within the same story each one we payed 500 euros..... and also the most childest thing somone can do is that Pir block us from our facebook account,so in the end i dont wish the worst for him but i hope within this kind of posts that in the future he will respect his clients and at least give a warranty 6 months or 1 year so he can progress on his frame products and keep selling otherwise we all know the bad end story....

Peace!
Alex Alexandridis

I disagree.
This is an issue of design choice and not fabrication.

If you supply a lightweight or poor design for your needs, its going to be weaker unless you have supplied a design that has been carefully stress tested etc.

The real question needs to be the following when it comes to custom frames :
Tubing : Did they supply the tubing you agreed to ?
Quality : Was the manufacturing mitring, jigging and welding up to scratch ?

If the answer is yes, then surely the responsibility has to come down to the specs.
If you chose the wrong design for the job and agreed to commission it to be made and it breaks, then that is not the manufacturers fault.

I feel for you both.
But maybe the responsibility lies with you choices of design.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2014, 12:12:38 PM by byke »

Offline byke

  • Backpacker
  • ******
  • Posts: 293
Re: BE CAREFUL with PIR PRODUCTS/STAY AWAY
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2014, 12:11:12 PM »
i do bunnyhop whips but i do them for 6 years now.
i ve  learn them with lighter frames weight 1.7 kg,like 4 frames from solid,i was doing them for hours and for lot of sessions,2 s&m intrikat frames,a wtp div frames and maybe others i cant remember the last 6 years..All of them no problem at all
the pir frame that is the heaviest of all cracked and the last year i only do them maybe one two times at a session or ever 2-3 sessions..
whoppers have nothing to do with those 3 frames

Yeah but the difference is that the weight is because of your design.